Ballerina: Inside a Flamethrower Fight So Real It Left Ana de Armas in Tears

This article contains some mild spoilers for From the World of John Wick: Ballerina.

When it comes to action, fight scenes and stunts, the world of John Wick has dominated the market. Each Wick world installment has delivered fresh, over the top sequences that are the epitome of stunt work today, pushing the edge of the envelope of what can be done in cinema. In From the World of John Wick: Ballerina, the standout stunts are fire—specifically the fire from flamethrowers. 

Lead stunt coordinators Jackson Spidell and Stephan Dunley are Wick World veterans. Spidell was John Wick’s (Keanu Reeves) stunt double for all the John Wick films except John Wick: Chapter 4.

“I was already on a project that went super long,” says Spidell regretfully. But he doubles again for Reeves in Ballerina. Dunlevy has also been with the franchise for a while, telling us he’s been with the production company 87North “for 10 years now, performed on John Wick 2 and 3, and was one of the coordinators on 4. So thankfully I had a ramp up and an insight into the world of John Wick.”

In an era where most cinematic action is strictly CGI, the fire stunts in Ballerina are almost entirely real and executed via practical stunts. 

“We like to do as much as practically possible and then come up with innovative ways to make it as safe as possible and as practical as possible,” Dunlevy says. “Everybody you see on fire was actually practically put on fire by a flamethrower.” 

“When you think of me, you should think of fire.” – Eve Macarro 

Spidell says working with high-powered flamethrowers is mentally and emotionally taxing but worth it in the end. For Ana de Armas, who brought the film’s protagonist Eve Macarro to life, the experience bordered on traumatic. The first time she lit a stuntman up in rehearsal, she broke down in tears.

“You know it’s not a natural thing to deliberately set someone on fire,” says Dunlevy “So for her coming in and doing it, there was an emotional thing.” However, once she got past that, she torched more stuntpeople than any other cinematic hero before her.

“Obviously, flamethrowers are dangerous weapons,” Dunlevy acknowledges, “so we’ve gotta have a lot of safety procedures in place and spend the time to be able to do that.” Not every production wants to spend that time, but the Wick team has always allowed its filmmakers to indulge in the craziest stunts and do it right, taking the time to make sure that every safety measure is in place.

With so much fire, Ballerina brought in Jayson Dumenigo, a fire specialist from Action Factory. Dumengigo created a new fireproof gel to protect stuntpeople. He even appears in Ballerina as one of Eve’s flamethrower victims. He gets blasted repeatedly in the middle of a snowy street. “So he’s like, ‘I’m not only the creator, I’m also a customer,’” laughs Spidell.  

Along with the new gel, there were other new methods to keep the fire stunts safe. Different flamethrowers were used for different scenes. Along with the conventional gas and extreme fuel-driven flamethrowers, there was a newly developed flamethrower that used a flammable powder intended for short distance shots. “It lights the powder up, which is crazy because it was like a pollen, and I’d never heard this before,” Spidell recounts.

Ultimately the pair estimates the production staged 187 full or partial burns in eight days—and with no incidents. “Everyone walked home,” Spidell beams with more than a hint of pride. 

“Fight like a girl”

Stepping into the role of Eve, de Armas had some big shoes to fill. She had worked with Reeves before in Knock Knock (2015). That was her first Hollywood film. However, unlike Reeves, who stands about an inch over six feet, and has an extensive background in judo, karate, and Brazilian jiu-jitsu, de Armas lacks a martial arts background. Nevertheless, she’s familiar with action cinema, having starred as Paloma, the scene-stealing Bond Girl in No Time to Die (2021), along with a few other action-oriented roles.

“But where she had a little tinge of that, working on John Wick, there’s nothing like it in terms of the depth that we put the actors through for training,” Dunlevy explains. “I know she had talked to Keanu prior to coming in,” adds Spidell, “and I’m pretty sure he was like, ‘Are you sure you want to ride this train?’”

“We sat down with her on that first day and were like, ‘Trust us. Go on this journey with us’” Dunlevy says, “and she did.” Both stunt coordinators say de Armas came into Ballerina with open arms and open eyes. According to them, the more she saw, the more she got into training. They have always been careful to only task each actor with stunts they were comfortable with, and there are times when they must dial talent back. But with de Armas, she wanted to do it all.

“She came in, guns blazing,” says Spidell, “and she let us push her and she answered back with intensity.” The whole team shared this vision of making everything as real as possible. There were very few CGI special effects. The bulk of the stunts were practical, which makes the actors’ reactions more real on an authentic visceral level. “She’s literally, at the end of the day, texting her bruises to [director Len Wiseman],” chuckles Dunlevy.

Eve Macarro is very different from John Wick. Wick’s story begins with him coming out of retirement after a long and legendary career as a hitman. He’s been out there and has experience. Ballerina is a creation story, beginning with Eve’s traumatic childhood, journeying through her intense assassin training with Ruska Roma, seeing her first missions, and finally her brutal acts of revenge. Unlike Wick, she’s new to this realm so she’s processing it all for the first time. “This character of Eve—don’t look at her as a female John Wick,” says Spidell emphatically. “We want her to be her own monster in her own right and have her own style.”

“You will always be smaller” – Nogi

Beyond coordinating stunts and doubling for Reeves, Spidell also gets to fight de Armas as the henchman Mikel. “We got to beat the crap out of each other,” recalls Spidell fondly, “and then she puts an axe in my face. It’s really good.” The absurd ultraviolence of the Wick universe is never lost on its makers, so ridiculous scenes have been a part of the franchise’s comic relief from the start. “The comedy beats hit,” Spidell adds, “and we were really proud of those moments.” When he takes that axe to the face, it’s so brutal that it’s impossible not to react. 

Along with chopping faces, Eve engages in a plate breaking fight that echoes the Three Stooges “Yeah, just like half of the budget [was spent on] breakaway plates for that,” Spidell jokes.  “That makes it ironic because we don’t want to take it too seriously. But we still want audiences to enjoy it.”

Some of the humor emerges from Eve’s stature.

“She’s smaller and lighter, so she’s not always going to be the biggest or fastest,” Dunlevy says. He feels that many female-centric action films go “that ‘80s robotic action route” like where they can’t be touched. Eve is different. She gets knocked down a lot. During her combat training under Nogi (Sharon Duncan-Brewster) at the Ruska Roma, she learns quickly that she must use every advantage—every cheat—to win. She improvises a lot, using her elements in her environment to gain the upper hand.

“You’ve got the ice skates,” says Dunlevy referencing a pivotal fight scene. “Improvised weapons have always been part of the John Wick universe with the pencil.” And for added authenticity, part of that scene was shot fighting on top of real ice. Ballerina explores the elements of fire and ice thematically throughout the film, while doing as much practically as possible. According to Dunlevy, it gets “a little bit of Jackie Chan-esque.”

Speaking of Asian action, one of the early villains Il Seong is played by Doohong Jung. Jung is a renowned Korean stuntman and actor who has been in dozens of notable projects on both sides of the Pacific, such as Fighter in the Wind (2004), G.I. Joe Retaliation (2013), Kundo: Age of the Rampant (2014), and many more. Previously the Wick world has included other major Asian action stars like Donnie Yen, Yayan Ruhian, Cecep Arif Rahman, and Tiger Chen.

“We’re martial arts nerds,” Spidell confesses, “so whenever we can, we take someone that we respect and know and give them the limelight.” Jung’s name came up when Spidell and Dunlevy were in development with Wiseman. Then the connection came through producer and John Wick franchise mastermind, Chad Stahelski, who knows everyone in the stunt business.

Dunlevy loved the idea of this Korean fight team coming in and changing things up with their big kicks. “We always try to make the different stylistic choices for different teams, just to give it a little nod to different martial arts and things like that.”

The future of the Wick World

Ballerina ends with a sequel teaser, one that echoes the conclusion of John Wick: Chapter 2. Both Spidell and Dunlevy are completely on board with a sequel if offered. Now that Eve is established, Spidell hopes she can develop and grow. “I’d love to eventually transition her to where when she walks in the room, they’re like ‘Oh shit, Eve is here,” the female equivalent of the Baba Yaga. She gets her own nickname.” 

And there’s talk of John Wick: Chapter 5, as well as another spin-off film based on Caine, the blind High Table assassin played by Donnie Yen. Spidell thought Ballerina would be the last time he would stunt double for Reeves. Toward the end of production, Reeves pulled him aside and said “We started this together. We could end it together.” Later Spidell replied “Well, you spoke too soon because now they’re gonna do a Chapter 5.”

However, neither Spidell nor Dunlevy could truly comment on the future of the Wick series. Both creators said that information was above their station.

“I try to stay away from that, just in case,” Dunlevy confesses, “because I like to talk so I’m going to do a Tom Holland and give something away.” 

From the World of John Wick: Ballerina is in theaters now.